In response to questions about whether it's worth it to buy some of the expensive coffees, consider the following: A pound of beans will make about 32 cups of coffee at the standard brew strength. Figure the price per cup, then consider what the local diner charges for their socks-water. Diner coffee is nearly always more expensive, and the waiter/ess expects a tip for serving it to you. Of course, big picture concerns are most important, so if a person's budget is really tight, that takes precedence. My point it that the choices at the top of the pricing scale aren't as expensive as they appear. - Anthony |
<Snip> budget <Snip> the <Snip> TRUE. My wisdom is that it's easier to work overtime for extra cash than to sacrifice quality. mas |
I'll tack on another factor for maing a purchase cost decision. (is that the right phrase?) The cost of use and implementation. And by this, I mean, what does it cost someone to roast a batch of said exensive beans and how many times are they allowed to create waste (throw away a bad batch/ruined batch) before it becomes to costly? Ideally, the coffee you buy green, roast, and then "use" should generate no waste. Realistically, though, I think it's (waste) is measurable and should be figured in to the purchase cost. Thoughts? -cas ---------- From: Anthony Ottman[SMTP:ddottman] Sent: Friday, May 05, 2000 8:49 AM To: Coffee List Subject: + Expensive coffees In response to questions about whether it's worth it to buy some of the expensive coffees, consider the following: A pound of beans will make about 32 cups of coffee at the standard brew strength. Figure the price per cup, then consider what the local diner charges for their socks-water. Diner coffee is nearly always more expensive, and the waiter/ess expects a tip for serving it to you. Of course, big picture concerns are most important, so if a person's budget is really tight, that takes precedence. My point it that the choices at the top of the pricing scale aren't as expensive as they appear. - Anthony |
True enough, but you've pointed out that my initial post included some implied assumptions, namely that: - one already has at least one roasting apparatus, - one is experienced with said apparatus, and - one has practiced achieving the desired roast color with less expensive choices. After these, any waste would be minimized. It's still very possible, and whenever I have beans that are expensive or in short supply, I'm nervous about ruining the batch. I'll even run a practice batch on something else first to get "warmed up." Well, that's a risk that adds excitement to the hobby. :-) - Anthony |
Well put enough. -cas ---------- From: Anthony Ottman[SMTP:ddottman] Sent: Friday, May 05, 2000 9:35 AM To: homeroast Subject: RE: + Expensive coffees *snip* |
Now that I re-read what you write, Anthony, ..... <Snip> I don't see the relevance of the first *assumption.* It becomes a moot point: of course it's assumed that a user has some means of roasting. Secondly, experience is only tied into _potential_ waste generation. So, it's not necessarily an assumption but more of a generalization. Thirdly, how exactly does the "less expensive" factor fit in? -cas |
<Snip>
YES ...dont start out your roasting career with a skillet and a pound of
Saint Helena!!! Actually, I had a local cusomter who wanted to try St
Helena buy a lb of Yirgacheffe and see what he thought. They are not the
same, but they do share the fact that they are both from "Horn of Africa"
seedstock and both washed process ...and have considerable citrusy flavors
and light body.
His wife loved Yirg, he didn't : he saved some money for sure.
Then again (and I say this from the point of a consumer who is very aware
of what it takes to produce a lb of truly specialty coffee) we really do
not pay much for the coffee we drink! On behalf of farmers, we need to be
paying more. The market is killing the good, small farmers and eventually
its going to kill quality.
Actually, you know what I think the biggest threat to quality coffee is
right now? Too much production of cheap coffees posing as Specialty
coffees. Big farms can produce at lower cost than true small farm growers.
They bring down the price overall. And even among small farms, there are
some people who are best served by GETTING OUT OF THE COFFEE BUSINESS!
Their land is not prime, it will never produce great coffee. They should
grow corn! While I beleivbe in Fair Trade etc, not all farmers should have
access to this to guatanty the make money for producing mediocre coffee.
They need to be told that their coffee is not good, and to change to a
different crop. THAT would serve their best interest in the long run. Yes,
farmers need better prices for thei coffee, but charity might cut both
ways...
Tom
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I agree in principle. I would gladly pay $1 more per pound if I knew the money was going to the producer. It wouldn't, however. The small farmer has no clout in a large, complex, international market such as that for coffee. I think the best thing we can do for the specialty producer is to demand quality coffee and be willing to pay the price. As long as the supply chain can see that there is a demand for uncompromised coffee it will continue to deliver it. We can exercise "demand" in other ways as well. Probably the best way is to spread the word and get others to appreciate the benefits of high-quality coffee. And if there is some campaign somewhere to raise awareness about the plight of the small producer I will gladly support it. Don At 02:38 PM 5/5/00 -0500, you wrote: <Snip> --- <Snip> |
At 02:38 PM 5/5/00 -0500, you wrote:
<Snip>
Another big factor are programs such as Great Eats on the Food Network that
continue to perpetuate myths. Such as: roasted coffee beans in those one
way valve bags will hold up for two or three months? Or that one can store
coffee for hours in a thermos? Of course, with stale beans who could tell
the difference?
Mediocre beans can never produce great tasting coffee. Unless home
roasting takes off in a big way, there is little chance of great coffee
being commonplace. If it did, then the price of some of the more pricey
beans would be even higher and probably out of sight. That is both a
blessing and a curse. Most are simply not prepared to spend the time to
roast green coffee beans. But once done, there is a night and day
difference if one is willing to spend the time and figure out how to do it
to one's own taste.
Carl
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Tom, I recently read about an auction of Brazilian specialty coffees? I wonder if you heard about it or maybe even participated. It was held under the auspices of one of the U.N. organizations, if I recall correctly. They held a competition to determine the best specialty coffees coming out of Brazil, then auctioned them off by lot. It sounded like a good effort to try to get some additional revenues for smaller farms that are trying to produce excellent coffees. I noted that Diedrichs bought one of the lots, and recently they marketed "the first Brazilian coffee that Martin [Diedrich] felt was good enough for Deitrich customers"... Of couse the roasted price was like $14.00 the pound. Anyway, I totally agree that the price of specialty coffee is very low compared to what you get in terms of quality. The process is really painstaking, the end product is so much better than the Folgers/Yuban/MJB dreck, yet the price premium isn't all that much. Kind of reminds me of the old days in California when we could buy a bottle of really fine Cabernet Sauvignon for about $10.00. It did seem kind of expensive at the time, but in retrospect, I wish I had bought and drunk a lot more. Back in the late 80's, a regular bottle of Caymus Cabernet was maybe $13, and the Special Selection was about $25. Now those wines go for $70 and $125 respectively! If you can find them. So everybody drink up that tasty, relatively inexpensive, specialtiy coffee that Tom finds for us, then buy some more! Regards, Jim Slaughter Slaughter & Slaughter, LLP js |