If all one has had for an espresso machine is a steam toy, and as many on this list and others would say that coffee shop espresso is hit or miss, how does one come to recognize good espresso? I think I'd like to invest in a superautomatic but if the above are true I wouldn't know if I have a taste for espresso or not when a good drip machine will do nicely (for both taste and wallet). Any thoughts besides a road trip? |
Personally, I've never had top-notch espresso from a super-auto. Even the fancy ones they're putting in Starbucks now. On the other hand, I've had really, really good Café Crèmas from my Solis 5Ks. If you buy a super-auto for espresso I think you'll be disappointed. Buy a super-auto to make Café Crèma! -- Rick |
Unless you have someplace to try a known properly done espresso, you are going to have to rely on second hand information from sources like this list and any other sources you have access to. My own experience is one of trying several things and finding that many of them did indeed improve the quality of the coffee. When I moved from the steam toy to a Gaggia Coffee, things got somewhat better. When I moved from stale store bought gourmet beans to home roasted greens from Sweet Maria's things got a lot better. When I went from a blade grinder to the Solis grinder things got better for a while. When I went from the Gaggia to a SL-90 things improved again. I experienced another major increase in quality of taste when I went from the Solis grinder to the Rocky. Then I had some more improvement when I went from the SL-90 to a Miss Silvia. Also when I was working with all these tools, I was learning how to work with coffee and what to look for in taste. One thing to remember is that there is not just one great coffee out there. There are a lot of very different flavors that can be extracted from the different beans by different roasting and brewing methods. However, it will not happen just by buying the best and greatest gadget, you are going to have to play with the beans and toys or tools for a while. Jim Gundlach On Monday, August 4, 2003, at 09:38 AM, Derek and Pat Savanella D.B.A. Heavenly Beans wrote: <Snip> |
Depending on where you live, some folk here can make recommendations on places that are likely to make you a good espresso so that you can experience their version of it. On the other hand, your not likely to produce great espresso with a superautomatic. My guess is that you'll produce something on a par with Starbux. Beyond the question of whether or not the intensity of espresso appeals to you (my wife dislikes straight espresso shots and feels the taste is too intense, but loves milk based drinks and Americanos), there are many taste experiences available to the home espresso enthusiast. I make straight shots out of damn near everything that I roast and enjoy the taste of nearly all of the single variety coffees that I also enjoy as drip / vacuum pot coffee. Bitterness attributed to espresso often can be blamed on stale beans, dirty equipment and lousy technique. Of course we all have the freshest beans since we're all home roasters here right? AFA technique goes, it really ain't that hard to learn. And since we care about coffee, we do keep our works clean right? Chances are that you'll enjoy the experience once you take the plunge. -Greg At 10:38 AM 8/4/2003 -0400, you wrote: <Snip> |
Greg, I think I have a similar situation, I have had some espresso I thought tasted good and enjoyed it while the wife does not-she'll also drink some capp's and Americanos and drip. That's another reason I considered the auto, choice of beverage and different wake-up times. Derek |
You know, you are definitely on the right track - find an espresso
you really like, and THEN figure out what it takes to make it at
home. I think a lot of people rush out and get equipment before
really knowing what the goal is, what the cup they want to create (or
recreate is). Now, in terms of the specifics it is hard to tell
someone exactly what they should look for. You can say that espresso
is 1-2 oz, but I dont think there is anything wrong with liking the
tall espresso where you run more water through it. Its a matter of
taste and in fact a long espresso is popular in italy, as a very
short one or ristretto is. In any case, an espresso without lasting
crema, is a disappointment for most people, since crema is part of
the espresso apellation and indicates that the variable of
temperature, time, grind, and pressure are in the right ranges. In
terms of flavors, alot of people like very sweet espresso made from
straight shots of milder coffees, as do I. But in some ways an
espresso without a strong bittersweet and a very long lasting
aftertaste isnt very similar to italian espresso. So thats my .02
cents. You have the unpleasant job of needing to visit every decent
looking coffee place and trying their espresso until you find
something that is yoor ultimate cup .. poor you!
Tom
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"Great coffee comes from tiny roasters"
Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting - Tom & Maria
http://www.sweetmarias.com Thomspon Owen george
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I notice you have Optimum Online service. If you're in the Long Island area, send me an e-mail and maybe I can provide you with one point of reference. DJ |
Derek, I empathize 100%. I don't think I have had the chance to know what I am missing when all I use is my Kaliffa Moka Pot and the stuff in the shops is never tops. I have had a couple of espressos in shops where I can appreciate a difference, the smoothness, etc.-but nothing to really blow my mind. I thought that investing a few hundred $$ without know what I could get out of the machine would be a big risk-so along came an offer for a 3 year old Gaggia Classic at $100. I was the first caller on this-but due to my procrastination (convincing the wife and checking out possible rust problems on Gaggias-I lost a chance to begin my espresso journey. I will be in Italy at the end of the month and hope to at least learn what the goal is! best, myron |